[Tlhingan-hol] KLBC: {-'e'} and {-bogh}

[qov at kli.org]

I just like writing sentences. Someone else specify something for me to
write sentences about, or I might not stop. Most of these sentences neither
use nor need -'e' but as an exercise you could think about where it could go
on each.

muD Duj QIH SorghwI'.
DaHjaj vengmajDaq 'oHtaH muD Duj QIHta'bogh SorghwI'.  => -'e' possible, but
completely unnecessary.
muD Duj QIHta'bogh SorghwI' muHlu'. => -'e' possible, but completely
unnecessary.
narghmeH muD Duj QIHta'bogh SorghwI', 'avwI' ngagh. => still unnecessary
Duj maSbogh Sa' Sorghta' 'urwI'. => -'e' unnecessary because the verb only
matches one of the possible objects
Duj maSbogh Sa' quchta' 'urwI'. => -'e' unnecessary because the verb only
matches one of the possible objects
Duj'e' maSbogh Sa' nejlI' nawlogh. 
Duj'e' maSbogh Sa' nejlI' nawlogh'e' ra'bogh Sa'.
Duj lunejl' wa'maH wa' rewbe'.
Duj lunejlI' qoq le' luchenmoHbogh wa'maH wa' rewbe'.  => -'e' can be used
on only one of rewbe' and qoq. Which?
Duj nejlI' qoq le' luchenmoHbogh wa'maH wa' rewbe'. => -'e' can be used on
only one of rewbe' and qoq. Which?
Duj nejlI' qoq le' chenmoHbogh wa'maH wa' rewbe'. => -'e' can be used on
either rewbe' or qoq, with different meanings.
HeghDI' loDnal'e' maSqu'bogh ta', tagh rInbe'bogh noH.  = The endless war
began when the emperor's favourite husband died.

DIr QIH tIH. = The ray damages skin.
tIH bach tal. = The cannon shoots a ray.
DIr Qan Sut le'. = Special clothing protects skin.
DIr Qanbe' Sut motlh. = Ordinary clothing does not protect skin.
DIr'e' Qanbe'bogh Sut le' = skin unprotected by special clothing [sentence
fragment]
DIr Qanbe'bogh Sut'e' = clothing that does not protect skin [sentence
fragment]
DIr'e' Qanbe'bogh Sut le' QIH tIH. = The ray damages skin that is
unprotected by special clothing.
DIr Qanbe'bogh Sut le''e' QIH tIH. = The ray damages special clothing that
does not protect skin.
qIjchoH DIr Qanbe'bogh Sut le'. = Skin unprotected by special clothing turns
black.
DIr QIHbogh tIH bach tal lo'bogh jagh.  => two ways to interpret, both are
equally useful.
DIr QIHbogh tIH nuD Qel Dorbogh chamwI'. = Four possibilities here; the two
below are the most likely.
DIr'e' QIHbogh tIH nuD Qel'e' Dorbogh chamwI'.
DIr QIHbogh tIH'e' nuD Qel Dorbogh chamwI''e'.
mang vaQHa'moH DIr QIHbogh tIH.
'up DIr QIHpu'bogh tIH.
mang HoH DIr QIHbogh tIH.
ra'wI' pon mang Qotlhbogh tIH. = "The soldier-disabling ray convinces the
commander." or "The soldier disabled by the ray convinces the commander."
che'ronDaq jachtaH negh Qotlhpu'bogh tIH.
che'ron ghatlh negh Qotlhpu'bogh tIH.
che'ronDaq negh Qotlhpu'bogh tIH'e' Qaw' jorwI'. = Explosives destroy the
ray that disabled soldiers on the battlefield.
che'ronDaq negh'e' Qotlhpu'bogh tIH Qaw' jorwI'. = Explosives destroy the
soldiers disabled by the ray on the battlefield.
veSvam yapbe'bej ngat ngaSbogh nIch'e'. = Gunpowder-containing ammunition is
definitely not sufficient for this warfare.
HIvQo' tIH leghpu'bogh QaS'e'. = Troops who have seen the ray refuse to
attack.
HIvqa'Qo' QaS rIQ leghpu'bogh HoD'e'.  = The captain who has seen the
injured troops refuses to resume the attack.
HeDlI'bogh QaS qIch ghu' yajbe'bogh totlh. = A commodore who doesn't
understand the situation condemns the retreating troops.
reH Hegh yoHwI'pu''e'. => Don't forget that this is the same -'e'. It simply
calls more attention to one of the nouns. 
toDSaH ghaH totlhvetlh'e'. = That commodore is a @#$%.  => This is the only
type of sentence in which the -'e' is required (for non-Morskans).

mu'tlhegh qontaHbogh Qov mevnISmoH vay'. :-)

  - Qov 'utlh
--
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http://www.kli.org/members-only/klcp-prep/




> -----Original Message-----
> From: qov at kli.org [mailto:qov at kli.org]
> Sent: January 17, 2016 13:33
> To: tlhIngan Hol mailing list
> Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] KLBC: {-'e'} and {-bogh}
> 
> So I do have something else to do, but I'm sad that there are no more
> example sentences, so I'm going to write some more.
> 
> HIch bach mang. = The soldier shoots the pistol. (Yeah, the official gloss
is
> "handgun" but I looked up both handgun and pistol in the Canadian Oxford
> and the definitions are too close to identical to whine about).
> Duy' HIch bachbogh mang. = The pistol the soldier shoots is defective. It
> could be interpreted that it was the soldier who was defective, but unless
it's
> a robosoldier, 'defective' isn't a word that would normally be used for a
> soldier. After reading the word Duy', I'm primed to look for a physical
object
> to be the subject of the sentence, so I latch onto HIch and read it
correctly
> without the help of -'e'.
> tlhIv HIch bachbogh mang. = The soldier who shoots the pistol is
> insubordinate. Again, unless we're dealing with advanced AI, there's only
> one side of the -bogh clause that can be the subject of the verb, so
reading it
> I disregard HIch as a possible subject and keep reading to mang.
> lo'laHbe' HIch bachbogh mang'e'. => No translation given here or below, so
> you have a chance to read such sentences for yourself and decide what they
> mean. It's not clear from your question whether your issue is with how to
> correctly place -'e', how to interpret it, or why you'd want the darn
thing in
> the first place.
> lo'laHbe' HIch'e' bachbogh mang.  => Either a soldier or a handgun can be
> useless, so the -'e' is useful here to indicate which is the useless item
in each
> sentence. It's still not required.  qunnoq HoD could watch a soldier fire
a
> handgun and proclaim "lo'laHbe'!" without telling his audience whether it
> was the personnel or equipment of which he disapproved.
> 
> And here's a bonus sixth sentence to show the power of not using -'e'.
> 
> chalDaq Qob nIn Hutlhbogh muD Duj.
> 
> It says two things at once, both true. It's also okay if the reader takes
just one
> meaning and moves on.
> 
> Personally, I only use -'e' in relative clauses if I think that without
it, an
> intelligent reader will take a meaning I didn't intend, or if the sentence
is
> sufficiently complex that -'e' will help the reader know when the relative
> clause ends.
> 
> - Qov
> 
> > mu'tlhegh qon be'. = The woman wrote a sentence.
> > mu'tlhegh qonbogh be' vIlaD. = I read the sentence the woman  wrote.
> > (I could use -'e' here, but it's obvious that you don't read a woman,
> > so why bother).
> > mu'tlhegh qonbogh be' vIparHa'. = I like the sentence the woman wrote.
> > OR
> I
> > like the woman who wrote the sentence.
> > mu'tlhegh'e' qonbogh be' vIparHa'. = I like the sentence the woman
wrote.
> > OR It's the sentence the woman wrote that I like.
> > mu'tlhegh qonbogh be''e' vIparHa'. = I like the woman who wrote the
> > sentence. OR It's the woman who wrote the sentence that I like.
> >
> > There's my five. I hope your plan works and once you get a good
> > collection
> of
> > examples, it falls into place.
> >
> > - Qov
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: mayql qunenoS [mailto:mihkoun at gmail.com]
> > > Sent: January 17, 2016 2:32
> > > To: tlhIngan Hol mailing list
> > > Subject: [Tlhingan-hol] KLBC: {-'e'} and {-bogh}
> > >
> > > qavan 'arHa'
> > >
> > > this may be an unusual request for the KLBC, however I will ask,
> > > because I can't seem to understand the use of {-'e'} when the
> > > {-bogh} comes into
> > play..
> > >
> > > could you write 5 sentences of your own, where there is {-bogh}, and
> > > the
> > {-
> > > 'e'} used to distinguish where the {-bogh} refers ?
> > >
> > > I'm asking that you write 5 sentences of your own, because I have
> > > already studied the TKD sentences and I didn't understand. Also, I'm
> > > not trying to write my own sentences, because I have no jay' idea
> > > how the ghe'tor I'm supposed to use {-bogh} and {-'e'} together.
> > >
> > > thanks
> > >
> > > cpt qunnoq
> > >
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> >
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> 
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