[Tlhingan-hol] yIghItlh to your heart's content

[John R. Harness]

jatlh De'vID:

>"While it's commendable that you're trying to use only Klingon on this
mailing list, there's a danger here that you might be making mistakes
which are not significant enough to impact others' grasp of your
intended meaning, but which you are reinforcing because you're not
getting the same feedback on that you'd get if you were writing in
English.

>I understood that you intend to say that you are about to translate
the sentences into English. But {DaH mu'tlheghmey DIvI' Hol vIchenmoH}
doesn't mean "now I make these sentences (into) English", it means
"now I create these sentences' English" or "now I create the English
of these sentences". Everyone will still understand you, but it's an
odd phrasing for what you want to say."

Yes, it is commendable what qunnoQ is doing. I don't understand then,
De'vID, why you go on to be so critical. qunnoQ is proving to be a devoted
Klingonist, and yet you chide them for not mastering every nuance of the
language from the start? If everyone will still understand -- if qunnoQ is
making themselves understood -- then we should applaud that and continue
applauding while their language skill improves (with, I might thankfully
add, your many helpful suggestions).

Let's get out of the habit of telling anyone not to try to communicate
using the language, or suggesting that the requirement for any utterance in
Hol is absolute grammaticality and pristine style.

jatlh, qunnoQ! jatlh!

'arHa




> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2015 10:55:41 +0100
> From: "De'vID" <de.vid.jonpin at gmail.com>
> To: tlhIngan Hol mailing list <tlhingan-hol at kli.org>
> Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] pab ngaSbe'lu'
> Message-ID:
>         <
> CA+7zAmOCLE2AqM2i-anVZX7Skh4-ZDSW0AqzXwCw+wFwOK1_kw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> qun HoD:
> > DaH, mu'tlheghmeyvam DIvI' Hol vIchenmoH :
> > <now,I make these sentences DIvI' Hol>
>
> While it's commendable that you're trying to use only Klingon on this
> mailing list, there's a danger here that you might be making mistakes
> which are not significant enough to impact others' grasp of your
> intended meaning, but which you are reinforcing because you're not
> getting the same feedback on that you'd get if you were writing in
> English.
>
> I understood that you intend to say that you are about to translate
> the sentences into English. But {DaH mu'tlheghmey DIvI' Hol vIchenmoH}
> doesn't mean "now I make these sentences (into) English", it means
> "now I create these sentences' English" or "now I create the English
> of these sentences". Everyone will still understand you, but it's an
> odd phrasing for what you want to say.
>
> Consider {mu'tlheghmeyvam vImughmeH DIvI' Hol vIlo'} or something like
> that.
>
> qun HoD:
> > {ngaSbe'bogh /tlhHm/,pab'e' Del boQwI' 'e' vItu'} <I found that boQwI'
> > describes grammar which TKD does not contain>
>
> Word order: {pab'e' ngaSbe'bogh TKD} for "grammar which TKD does not
> contain"
>
> qun HoD:
> > {ghantoHmey : {...lawbe'...puSbe'},{...law...law},{-Daq} QInHommey..}}
> > <examples : {...lawbe'...puSbe'},{...law...law},{-Daq} comments>
>
> maj.
>
> qun HoD:
> > {chaq,pabvam /tlhHy'/ boje' 'oH qech QaQ} <perhaps it is a good idea
> > to feed this grammar to KLI>
>
> I don't understand what it means to "feed" grammar to the KLI. The KLI
> is not an animal or creature.
>
> In fact, since some of the post-TKD grammar is found in HolQeD, which
> is published by the KLI, the KLI is in possession of the canon sources
> of such grammar. It's the casual Klingonist who has no access to back
> issues of HolQeD who can't find out what has been amended or clarified
> since TKD, etc.
>
> qun HoD:
> > {jIDo'mo',pabvam vIlegh 'ach tu'be'laHba' latlh taghwI'} <because I
> > was lucky I saw this grammar,however another beginner may obviously
> > miss it>
>
> For this sense of "can" ("there is a possibility that..."), it's not
> really appropriate to use {-laH}, which signifies ability ("is able
> to..."). Obviously, a beginner *is able to* miss seeing the new
> grammar, but that's not what you mean.
>
> (Although, I think many people, even experienced speakers, use {-laH}
> for this meaning because "can" has both senses in English.)
>
> Try {chaq} instead.
>
> --
> De'vID
>
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