[Tlhingan-hol] Trains

[Felix Malmenbeck]

Aye, I'm aware of the rule; it's just not something I'd take for granted works in a relative phrase.
In cases like {Qel'e' DaH yISam}, you can more or less think of {DaH yISam} as its own sentence, {Qel'e'} being a context descriptor. [If they'd already been talking about doctors, they might've been able to say simply «DaH yISam!»]
I gues you can sort of see it that way with the p'b sentence, but it's not something I'd've taken for granted.
________________________________________
From: Rohan Fenwick - QeS 'utlh [qeslagh at hotmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2012 23:53
To: tlhingan-hol at kli.org
Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Trains

ghItlhpu' Felix, jatlh:
> I believe this was first seen in paq'batlh, with the phrase {lujang maS’e’ loQ So’be’bogh QIb lurur} ("They reply, shaped as the crescent moon.")
> This phrase rather interestignly shows {loQ} coming after the object; not sure if that's allowed because of the -'e', or some undiscovered grammatical rule, or just fancy language.

This has been rehashed several times on the list; this very pattern is explicitly discussed in the TKD Addendum, section 6.8.

As for "undiscovered grammatical rule", my personal belief is that the pattern can be simply interpreted using rules we already have. I think {loQ} can come after the object here because {-'e'} is a Type 5 suffix, and like all nouns with Type 5 suffixes (see TKD section 6.1), it is possible to put an {-'e'}-marked noun in the so-called "header" position, at the beginning of the sentence: cf. {qIbDaq SuvwI''e' SoH Dun law' Hoch Dun puS} "you would be the greatest warrior in the galaxy" from, I believe, ST5.

QeS