[Tlhingan-hol] mIl'oD veDDIr SuvwI': 'ay' 2 - yIlop; chaq wa'leS maHegh!

[Robyn Stewart]

On 2012-07-30, at 8:03, Rohan Fenwick - QeS 'utlh <qeslagh at hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> jIH:
>> Warnings will come as appropriate.
> 
> Qov:
>> nuvpu'vam 'IH DaDeltaHmo', nga'chuqwI'pu'mo' jughuHrupmoH 'e' vItul.
>> (nga'chuqpa' ghun vIpoQbe' jIH; lut nong vItIv neH). Sepvam tIghmey
>> vISovbe'chu'mo', qaSlaH ... Hoch!
> 
> Hu'tegh, bIboHbej, qar'a'?

jIloSqangbej. QIt qaSchugh vItIv. vuDmeywIj DaSov vIneH neH. 

> :P 'ach nongchoHbej lut, vaj DuQuchmoHjaj!

tlhIngan Kama Sutra vIloS. 

> jIH:
>> 2. yIlop; wa'leS chaq maHegh!
> 
> Qov:
>> permeylIj vItIvbejtaH.
> 
> ru' bIH. permey vItu'meH TKW vItlhIl. Hut permey nIv vIghaj. 'ach tugh
> yapbe'choH TKW 'e' vIHar... vaj chaq 'op vIchoH. wej jISov.

Hamlet vIttlheghmey DalISlaH je. 

> jIH:
>> joH puqbe' che'choHmoHlu'
> 
> Qov:
>> wot cho' Daqelpu''a'?
> 
> HIja'... Hard to explain why I went for che'choH. I thought cho' had
> more of a focus on the event of the transition from old ruler to new,
> where che'choH feels more like focusing on just the new ruler. Maybe
> I'm overthinking it. (I do that a lot. Can you tell?)

I don't know the original ( and I like not knowing) so I don't know what you're going for specifically. There's nothing wrong with the effect achieved ... although I must admit I thought this sentence was saying she had taken over, until we got to people arriving for the coronation later. Maybe a tugh would have helped. 

> jIH:
>> net maqDI', joH mangghom la' belqu'moHlu'.
> 
> Qov:
>> Consider rearranging this so that <la' belqu'moH qech/wanI'> or
>> <joH cho'rupchoHmo' puqbe' belqu'>. belqu'moHmo' indefinite subject,
>> loQ jum, belqu'moHwI' wISovbejmo'.
> 
> 'e' vIlajqangbej. I was vacillating on whether to use la' belqu'moH
> wanI' De', thinking it'd seem like fishing for a placeholding noun
> that wasn't quite necessary.

We say "he was pleased" all the time in English, but the indefinite-ness seems stronger in Klingon. 

> jIH:
>> la' ghaH 'avtanDIl'e';
> 
> Qov:
>> It's the opposite way as I would write it when la' is a known
>> quantity and avtanDIl is the new information.
> 
> I argued this with Quvar a while ago on Facebook. Neither of us was
> able to convince the other. :)
> 
> Let's put it this way: I think both are possible so I'm glad to
> change it if you prefer. But with the questions of the form {X nuq}
> from CK (i.e. Dochvam nuq "what is this thing?", Daqvam nuq "what is
> this place?"), since 'Iv and nuq appear where the answer is expected
> to go (TKD p.69), I believe the answer would normally appear with
> the word order Dochvam 'oH "it is this thing" or Daqvam 'oH "it is
> this place". That means the new data slots in after the pronoun-as-
> verb: Dochvam 'oH betleH'e' "this thing is a bat'leth", Daqvam 'oH
> vaS'a''e' "this place is the Great Hall".
> 
> Added to that is the Morskan dialect question from ST6: Dujvetlh
> 'oH nuq "what ship is that?". Again, since nuq appears where the
> answer is expected, then the new information, the answer, should be
> final: Dujvetlh 'oH 'entepray'('e') "that ship is the Enterprise".

So long as you've thought about it. 

> jIH:
>> mangghom ra'wI''a' puqloD ghaH,
> 
> Qov:
>> nepotism much this kingdom? :-)
> 
> bIlughchu'! But then, isn't that what feudalism's all about? :)

Plus there's only a small group of people with access to education, and limited fields for the educated to enter, so where else is the General's smart kid going to end up. 

> jIH:
>> 'ach 'IHqu' je ghaH'e';
> 
> Qov:
>> mumerDI' ta' puqbe' parmaqqay qelbe'bogh lut'e', jItuvHa'law' neH.
> 
> Hee, teHbej. There'll be plenty of that later on (warnings will be
> forthcoming not just for violence and death, but for excessive mush
> as well). But don't write off your initial assessment of tIna'tIn
> just yet.

vItIv. lutwIjDaq parmaqqaypu' Datoghpu''a'? vabDot ngaHvaD parmaqqay vInob. 

> jIH:
>> «woch; Sor rur»[6] jatlh 'op, «'IH; maS jul je rur»[7] jatlh 'op,
>> «pup; qut rur» jatlh 'op.
> 
> Qov:
>> toH. nuvpu' 'IH ghajbej wo'vam. qun neH qel 'ay'meyvam 'e' vIpIHchoH.
>> chaq nuvpu'vam puqloD ghaH mIl'oD veDDIr loD.
> 
> nuvpu' potlh lucherlu'lI' neH... tlhoy bIloSnISbe'. :) yItuv'eghmoH!

Hoch 'ay'Hom vIwaH 'ej vIyIv 'ej vIghup ghIq tera' tangqa' vIrur: vIghupHa' 'ej vIyIvqa'. jISIv 'e' vItIv. 

> jIH:
>> ghaH luHoHlaw'lI' tIna'tIn 'IH mInDu'Daj 'IH je.
> 
> Qov:
>> tIna'tIn 'IH, mInDu'Daj 'IH je chev mevwI' Degh 'e' vImaS.
> 
> maj. chevwI' Degh, mevwI' Degh, yevwI' Degh je vISeHchu'be' 'ej loQ
> vIwaH. vay' choHlu' DaneHchugh, reH HIja'!

laDmeH ngeDbe'DI' qaja'. 

> jIH:
>> tIqDajDaq parmaqDaj So'taH 'avtanDIl.
> 
> Qov:
>> qatlh? parmaqvetlh tuch'a' vav? nuch ghaH'a'?
> 
> joH'a'Daj puqbe' ghaH tIna'tIn'e', vaj joH juH'a' Dab. pIjHa' neH ghaH
> leghlaHmo' 'avtanDIl, tIna'tInvaD parmaq SIQtaHbogh maqlaHbe'chu' 'e'
> vIHar. 'ach Sep joH toy'chu' 'avtanDIl, vaj joH mojDI' tIna'tIn, pay'
> ghaH'e' SuchchoHlaH 'avtanDIl 'ej jatlhmeH meqmey ghajchoH.

maj :-)

> 
>> rurchuq Hoch loDpu'.
> 
> Hoch maH ghopumQo'. :P
> 
> (poD vay')
> 
> 
> jIH:
>> cheghqa'DI' 'ej tIna'tIn leghqa'DI', tIqDaj lumeQqa'moHlu' 'ej
>> lu'aw'qa'lu'[8].
> 
> Qov:
>> That one caught me out two when I described three hearts beating in
>> an embrace. There's more, and more recent canon supporting one
>> Klingon heart.
> 
> jang je Voragh, jatlh:
>> Time Lords may have two hearts, but Klingons have only one, eight-
>> chambered heart (cf. TNG "Ethics").
> 
> qatlho', Voragh. lI'qa'bej qawHaq'a'lIj! (Good thing, too - I could
> see that at some stage I'd slip with heart numbers and having to deal
> with just one is much simpler.)
> 
> jIH:
>> vupmoH parmaq;
> 
> Qov:
>> vupmoH'a'?
> 
> The original is "Love is pitiable". vupmoH parmaq was supposed to be
> "love causes (unspecified object) to be pitied". qaq'a' {vay' vupmoH
> parmaq}?

HIja'. vulmoH DaghItlhHa'pu' 'e' vIqel.

> jIH:
> (poD vay')
>> joH mojmoH 'e' maqDI' tIna'tIn vav, QuchchoH 'ej tulchoH 'avtanDIl;
>> joH puqbe' So'lu'pu'mo' moghpu'.
> 
> Qov:
>> joH puqbe' So'lu'pu''a'? So' 'Iv?
> 
> vay'. :P joH juH'a' Dab; chuQun ghaHmo' pIjHa' juH'a' mejnIS. chIch
> tIna'tIn So'lu'be'; motlh juH'a' qoDDaq ratlhmo' qaS neH.

yaj. 

> jIH:
>> DaH jatlh'egh: «naghboch rurchu'bogh qabDaj'e' DaH reH vIleghlaH;
>> chaq vaj qabwIj vIDoqqa'moHlaH 'ej tIqwIj vIvorlaH.»
> 
> Qov:
>> DoqHa'choHpu''a' qabDaj?
> 
> A leftover from a metaphor that was pretty strained when rendered
> into the Klingon. The Georgian says that when Avtandil couldn't see
> Tinatin, "his rose faded" - i.e. the "roses" of his cheeks. I got rid
> of the first bit, as it seemed a bit off, but forgot to deal with
> this as well.

yaj.

> jIH:
>> wa''uy' nuv mangghom Dev 'avtanDIl,
> 
> Qov:
>> law'qu'!
> 
> law'bej! 'ach vIpuSmoHta'; DIvI' Hol bomDaq "ten thousand times a
> thousand" 'oH. (Georgia Hol bom vImughDI', "many thousands" neH
> ja'lu'. Dojqu'moH 'e' nIDlaw' DIvI' mughwI'...)

jIHagh!

> jIH:
>> jul rurtaHvIS qabDaj; chuQun ghomDaq SaH je joH toy'wI' nIvqu',
>> Soghrat, 'ej joHDaq Sum je ghaH.
> 
> Qov:
>> bong parmaq SovchoHchugh Soghrat 'ej tIna'tInvaD ja'chugh, Mills
>> & Boone DamughlI'.
> 
> ghe''orvo' narghDI' qa'pu'! :P

lutvam SeghvaD DuHHa'be'!

> jIH:
>> chuQun tlheghmey
> 
> Qov:
>> QamtaHbogh nuvpu' DelmeH <tlheghmey> vIpar.
> 
> teH'a'? mu' {tlhegh} wIlo'Qo'chugh, "ranks" "files" "queues" joq
> DIponglaHbe'chu'.

jISov. 'ach chuQun lubaghbogh tlheghmey vIlegh, QamtaHbogh nuvpu' vIleghpa'. 

> pup 'oH 'e' vIHar. 'ach naDev 'utbe' {tlheghmey}, vaj vIqIlqang. 
> 
> jIH:
>> veghtaHvIS tIna'tIn vavDaj je, wovqu' 'ej 'IH tIna'tIn qab.
>> quS'a'Daq puqbe'Daj ba'choHmoH joH. ghopDu'Daj'e' lo'taHvIS,
>> tIna'tIn nachDaq joH mIv'a' lan, tIna'tIn ghopDaq joH ghanjaq lan,
>> tIna'tIn volchaHDaq joH ngup lan.
> 
> Qov:
>> tay DaDelchu'.
> 
> maj. ({ngup} vIlo'laHpu'mo' jIbel. 'ej vIchelbe'pu' jIH; /samoseli/
> "garments, clothing" lo'pu' Georgia Hol chovnatlh, vaj mughmeH pup
> {ngup} 'e' vItu'.)

jIQochbe'. 

- Qov

> 
> QeS
>                         
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