[Tlhingan-hol] Klingon Word of the Day: van bom

[SuStel]

I’m not sure this is an absolute restriction. We haven’t SEEN {ben} used on its own, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be. 

-- 
SuStel
http://trimboli.name

From: mayql qunenoS
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2016 3:31 AM
To: tlhingan-hol at kli.org
Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Klingon Word of the Day: van bom

voragh :
> {ben} "years ago" isn't used without a number or quantity noun preceding it

thank you Ca'non master for telling me this ! So far I believed, that
one can use {ben} on its own. Luckily, now I learned the correct way
of using it. thanks !

mayqel mIv Hurgh qunnoq
attack now, or be slaves in their world



On Wed, Mar 23, 2016 at 5:46 PM, Steven Boozer <sboozer at uchicago.edu> wrote:
> mayql qunenoS wrote:
>> ben, Sepmaj van bom wIqonmeH nuQaH muchwI' 'e' wItlhob.
>> years ago, we requested that a musician helps us in order
>>  to compose our national anthem.
>
> AFAIK {ben} "years ago" isn't used without a number or quantity noun preceding it:
>
>   cha'vatlh ben HIq vItlhutlh
>   I will drink Two Century Old Ale. PK
>
>   vagh SanID ben buDbe' wamwI'pu'.
>   5,000 years ago, hunters were not lazy. (st.k 11/99)
>
>   nen rav: chorgh ben
>   AGES 8 to Adult  (Monopoly)
>   ["maturation minimum (lit. "floor"): eight years old"]
>
>   'op ben pa' Dab ngan 'ej chep
>   [translation not available] (PB)
>
> Okrand has discussed {ben}:
>
> (st.k 12/12/96):  The word {ben} can be used to mean "years old", but in Klingon, one doesn't say "I am X years old". The phrase {loSmaH ben jIH}, if anything, would mean "40-year-old me" or the like. It would parallel {cha'vatlh ben HIq} "Two Century Old Wine". "I am 40 years old" would be expressed as: {loSmaH ben jIboghpu'}. This is "I was born 40 years ago". As is normal in Klingon sentences, the time element (in this case, {loSmaH ben} "40 years ago") comes first.
>
> (HQ 8.3:3):  With longer time periods, such as a century ({vatlh DIS poH}), millennium ({SaD DIS poH}), or a period of 10,000 years (myriad, perhaps) ({netlh DIS poH}), the words {ret} ["period of time ago"] or {pIq} ["period of time from now"] may be used in place of {poH}, e.g., {cha' vatlh DIS poH} "two centuries", but {cha' vatlh DIS ret} "two centuries ago". The phrase {cha' vatlh ben} would mean "200 years ago". The choice of construction depends on what is being emphasized: in this case, the total number of centuries (two) or the total number of years (200).
>
> A better option is to follow the PB example:  {'op ben} "some years ago" using the noun {'op} "some, an unknown or unspecified quantity".  Okrand has also used {'opleS} "one day [in the future]" (written as one word) in the paq'batlh:
>
>   qeylIS loDnI' 'opleS chovan
>   One day, brother Kahless, you will bow before me (PB 58f.)
>
>   qeylIS loDnI' | 'opleS bIHaghbe' | 'opleS 'opleS 'opleS
>   [translation not available] PB
>
> *{leS} "days from now" seems to be a bound morpheme in compound nouns - e.g. {wa'leS} tomorrow, {cha'leS} day after tomorrow - and not a separate word.
>
> All that being said, I have seen *{ben law'} "many years ago, long ago" and *{ben law'qu'} "long, long ago, once upon a time" used on this List when talking about legends and myths - but never by Okrand.  Even here the feeling was that {ben} still needed to be modified somehow.
>
>
> --
> Voragh
> tlhIngan ghantoH pIn'a'
> Ca'Non Master of the Klingons
>
>
>
>
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