[Tlhingan-hol] Klingon Word of the Day: DIvI'

[mayql qunenoS]

thank you Qov and SuStel for taking the time to reply ; thank you too
voragh for sharing all those wonderful canon sentences !

After reading carefully (as I always do) your comments, these are my
observations :

1. I messed up (again) the order of the verb suffixes ; I really need
to find a way to remember their correct order. Unfortunately, so far,
I have not been able to do so. I remember the type 1, I remember the
type 7, and the type 9 ; everything else in between is a blur. And
what's even worst is that I can't find a way to fix this problem. The
noun suffixes follow a "logical" pattern (at least in my head they do)
; the verb prefixes however seem somehow "arbitrary". Anyway, this
seems to be a problem which will stay with me for a while, at least
until I find a way to fix it.

2. I read again this sentence {noH ghuHmeH DIvI'vetlh luchenmoHpu'
vIghro'} (after sleep, coffee, etc) and I'm afraid that the
fed,rested, and caffein-filled self of today, will agree with the
hungry, tired and sleepy self of yesterday. Since on the
{luchenmoHpu'} there is the prefix {lu-} this means that we must have
the they-him/her/it meaning expressed ; and indeed we have the
{vIghro'} which by the use of this prefix are meant to be many, and
the federation as the object of the {luchenmoHpu'}. So, I can't
understand a way in which the {DIvI'} could be supposed not to be the
object of the {luchenmoHpu'} but the object of the {ghuH} instead.

3. I agree on the comments with regard to the use of {-vo'} on the
"cleansed the world from dogs" phrase. To confess my sin, I wasn't too
happy about it yesterday either. I went ahead and wrote it anyway,
because my mind had stuck and I couldn't find any other way of
describing the desired meaning.

4. The {ghobrup} is a great idea to say "prepared for war". I realize
now that both {-rup} and {-beH} are wonderful suffixes, which for
reasons unknown I always tend to forget their existence.

5. ..and of course the whole noH/veS confusion. Perhaps I tend to
confuse them, because now that I think of it, in greek we don't have a
specific word for "warfare". If I was thinking in english while I was
writing in klingon I would use {veS} ; apparently I was thinking in
greek while I was writing in klingon so I used {noH}. there are times
my own mind puzzles me..

6. I liked very much the {tugh taghpu' noH}. I remember now that way
back, sometime, I wondered about whether I could use the {tagh} to
describe that a war starts, however for reasons which currently elude
me, I thought that it couldn't be applied in such a way.

thank you very much Qov, SuStel, voragh je for replying !

mayqel mIv Hurgh qunnoq
you have some stuffed to'baj leg in your teeth

ps: If someone knows a way of remembering the order of verb suffixes,
I would be grateful if he told me too !

On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Steven Boozer <sboozer at uchicago.edu> wrote:
> mayql qunenoS wrote:
>>> DIvI'chaj Degh yIlegh ! targhvaD jatlhpu' vIghro' la'. reH lIghIjchoH
>>>   Deghvam !
>>> look at our federation insiginia ! said the cat commander for the
>>> []  dogs. this symbol will make scared you forever !
>
> SuStel:
>> I would leave off the {-choH}. It's not forever starting to scare them,
>> and the idea of starting isn't really important here (according to your
>> English translation). Just say {reH lIghIjchoH Deghvam}.
>>
>> You might even consider adding a {-jaj} to the sentence, though it's not
>> essential.
>
> {ghIj} "scare" - not "be scared" - in canon:
>
>   jaghpu'lI' DaghIjjaj
>   May you scare your enemies! PK
>
>   jaghmeylI' DaghIjjaj, qetjaj jaghmeylI'
>   May you scare your enemies, may your enemies run. TKW
>
> [N.B. (TKD 23f):  This suffix [{-mey}] ... can also be used with nouns referring to beings capable of using language (those nouns which take {-pu'}). When it is so used, it adds a notion of "scattered all about" to the meaning. Compare: {puq} "child", {puqpu'} "children", {puqmey} "children all over the place".]
>
>   qo'mey Sar charghtaHvIS chaH Dat tlhIngan may'Duj luleghDI' neH qIb
>     nganpu' buQpu' may'Duj 'ej ghIjpu' 'oH.  nIteb ghIjpu' je Deghvam
>   this symbol grew to become as feared throughout the galaxy as the
>     menacing profiles of their battlecruisers. (SkyBox SP1)
>
>   vay' DaghIjlaHchugh bIHoSghaj
>   Fear is power. TKW
>
> ["The meaning of this saying, of course, is that one who has the ability to instill fear can exert control over those who are afraid; there is more to power than physical force." (TKW 109)]
>
>   not qoHpu''e' neH ghIjlu'
>   Only fools have no fear. TKW
>
>   jIDoghqu' vIghIjlu'mo' 'ej bortaS vIneHmo' jIleghlaHbe' 'ach chovuvtaH
>   What a fool I have been, blinded by fear and spite, and still you find
>    me worthy. PB
>
> Other options are {Haj} "dread" and {lIm} "panic" - although I don't know if Okrand has ever used either in sentences.  (Anything in the paq'batlh?)
>
>
> --
> Voragh
> tlhIngan ghantoH pIn'a'
> Ca'Non Master of the Klingons
>
>
>
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