[Tlhingan-hol] Type 5 on first noun

[Brent Kesler]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2016 at 1:33 PM, SuStel <sustel at trimboli.name> wrote:

>
> Using phrases that are not complete sentences is fine provided the phrase
> is a complete idea. I'd have no idea with a title phrase {qep'a'vo' puvmeH}
> because the idea is complete. The idea is "for the purpose of flying from
> the conference." You're describing the purpose of the chapter, or whatever
> it is you're naming.
>

1. The way I remember it, you need to have a complete sentence to have a
complete idea.
2. To me, neither {qep'a'vo' puvmeH} nor {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a'} are complete
ideas (though I'm okay with both as sentence fragments).
3. In fact, both seem equally incomplete to me (if that even makes sense).

Why is it okay to assume that {qep'a'vo' puvmeH} somehow describes the
chapter, but NOT okay to assume that {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a'} somehow describes
the chapter? If you went to the Feast at QamchIy and saw that they hung a
banner over the entrance that read {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a'), would you say that
banner is incorrect? Because that's kinda what you're doing: telling
Klingons they made a mistake on their own banner.


{N1-5 N2 [X]} where X doesn't appear is not a complete idea. You've taken
> away a vital component of the phrase. {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a' SOMETHING}.
> {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a'} isn't describing your chapter if it's about the
> SOMETHING.
>

Couldn't you say the same thing about {qep'a'vo' puvmeH [X]} where X
doesn't appear? I don't see why X can be left unstated with {qep'a'vo'
puvmeH}, but not with {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a' X}.

Is it just because one has a verb and the other doesn't? To me, as long as
it ends with a Type 9, the verb doesn't make the idea any more complete.
"Because it's cold outside" seems just as incomplete to me as all these
other examples. In each case we can tell there's some X missing and that we
have to figure it out from context.

And now I'm probably pouring gas on the fire, but why assume that the
missing X *follows* {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a'}? As long as we're debating sentence
fragments, why can't the phrase be {QamchIyDaq X 'uQ'a'}? Maybe the
complete version is {QamchIyDaq qaSpu' 'uQ'a'}. I think that would make a
good chapter title. We could even do something similar with {telDaq
wovwI'mey}: {telDaq wov wovwI'mey}. Maybe we can remove the verb in both
cases because it doesn't really add meaning. Of course lights shine, and of
course feasts happen. Let's cut those verbs for the sake of brevity (a
Klingon might say).


bI'reng
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