[Tlhingan-hol] KLBC: verb-verb SAO

[John R. Harness]

I think I am missing a few emails for some reason, to get from qunnoq's
question to Qov's response.

What I think Qov is pointing out is the use of -choH to solve qunnoq's
question. For what it's worth, the sentence {taghwI' pabpo' vIghel 'e'
vImevlaHbe'} seems like a reasonable sentence in that it is grammatical and
gets the point across. But using -choH to signal the change in the verb is
more concise (always good for Klingon) and is a fuller engagement with the
grammar. (I sort of want to say that it is "*more* grammatical.") We've got
all those suffixes, why not use them to the fullest!

I don't want to digress too far into the murky waters of English grammar;
but,  I will point out regarding qunnoq's original question that this is a
good example of an area where Klingon and English behave differently.
Phrases like "I like eating" are made with gerunds -- "eat" has been turned
into a noun with the -ing ending. Klingon has something like this, the
seldomly seen -ghach ending. But we don't go throwing -ghach around just
anywhere. Instead, Klingon requires two verbs-that-are-still-acting-like
verbs and 'e'. EXCEPT, of course, as Qov points out, when we have other
suffixes that cover the intended meaning.

'arHa



--



On Mon, Feb 1, 2016 at 2:35 PM, <qov at kli.org> wrote:

> > > jIghelbe'choHlaHbe'
> >
> > hmm.. interesting.. how would I approach this ? lets see..
> >
> > If I take this from the end backwards, it could be " I am not able to
> > be/become" ; then comes the {jIghelbe'} which I would translate <I don't
> > ask>. So, putting the two together this could mean <I'm not able to
> > be/become (that) I don't ask>. I *feel* the meaning coming through.
> > What would be the exact translation though ?
>
> It's not about you becoming something. It's about a change in the action.
>
> jIghel = I ask
> jIghelbe' = I don't ask
> jIghelchoH = I transition from asking to not asking, i.e. I start asking
> OR I change my questioning tactics. It's going to be understood as starting
> to ask, unless you make it clear that you were already asking.
>
> tawDaq vum wIqop. puHDujmajDaq maba'taHvIS loQ vIyu' 'a jangQo'mo'
> jIghelchoH. ghaHvaD taj vI'ang 'ej HughDaj mej'aD vIDel. jangchoH.
> (taj vI'angpa' jIghel, 'ach vI'angmo' jIghelchoH. bIyaj'a'?)
>
> jIghelbe'choH = I change to not asking, I transition from asking to not
> asking.
> jIghelbe'choHlaH = I can transition from asking to not asking OR I begin
> to be able to not ask
> jIghelbe'choHlaHbe' = I am not able to transition to not asking.  OR I
> become unable to not ask.
>
> - Qov
>
>
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