[Tlhingan-hol] 'arDaq

[Robyn Stewart]

For the record, whenever I write or utter such a phrase, that's exactly what I mean. I pause to consider how the sentence might be completed, and like the BOP poster I would probably include a few instances of not dropping the jomlu' or vIleghlaH so the pattern was clear.

If HoD Qanqor gets back to me about his opinion on muSuch mIvDaq yIH, I'll share what he has to say,

- Qov

-----Original Message-----
From: SuStel [mailto:sustel at trimboli.name] 
Sent: June 19, 2014 9:16
To: tlhingan-hol at kli.org
Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] 'arDaq

On 6/18/2014 2:46 PM, Robyn Stewart wrote:
> With something like {mIvDaq yIH} sitting on its own, I see it as the 
> beginning of {mIvDaq yIH vIlegh}, which I'm okay as interpreting as me 
> not being in the hat too, thanks to <pa'vo' pagh leghlu'> (the room 
> has no view) from the tapes. I'm happy with a sentence fragment being 
> used as a standalone title. I would reject *{muSuch mIvDaq yIH}.
>
> Likewise  {telDaq wovmoHwI'mey} could be expanded to {telDaq 
> wovmoHwI'mey lujomlu'} and it seems perfectly reasonable to omit the 
> verb. luch jomlu'bogh bopmo' Doch naQ.

This is the usual defense for these phrases, but I don't buy it. You COULD expand such phrases, but that's not what their writers/utterers meant. I'm sure, for instance, that Krankor simply forgot about the rule, and that he would accept *{muSuch mIvDaq yIH}. If you subsequently pointed out the rule, he'd say it was a stupid rule, and would continue violating it.

I think any canonical examples of N-5 N are either errors, exceptions, or a special grammar we haven't discovered, as Voragh suggested. I don't think they're sentences that happen to have been cut off at exactly the right moment that they completely coincidentally look exactly like an original English noun–prepositional phrase.

-- 
SuStel
http://www.trimboli.name/

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