[Tlhingan-hol] nuq bop bom: 'ay' wa'vatlh wa'maH chorgh: <ghIqtal>

[lojmIt tI'wI'nuv]

{chuS} doesn't mean "make noise". It means "be noisy". A room can be noisy without making any noise. Any place that an observer would be in, noting noise, is a noisy place. 

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On Jan 7, 2012, at 5:02 AM, "De'vID jonpIn" <de.vid.jonpin at gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> Qov:
> > latlh raSDaq Sup ghutar, jatlh “wot'av, torgh puqloD! batlh qelDI' tlhIngan, lumbe'. Do'Ha' DaHjaj betleHwIj'e' vInaw'laHbe'. wa' munojqangchugh vay', DaH qaHay'.”
> 
> Does {Hay'} take an object?  I thought it was one of those verbs where all the participants are in the subject (like {ghom}), but I didn't find any canon evidence to back up my intuition.
> 
> Qov:
> > chuSqu'choH SopwI'pa'.
> 
> Is it the {SopwI'pa'} itself that's beginning to be noisy, or something inside it?  This is just a stylistic preference, but I'd have written {chuSqu'choH SopwI'pa' qoD} or {SopwI'pa'Daq chuSqu'choHlu'}.  {chuSqu'choH SopwI'pa'} sounds to me like the mess hall itself is making noise.  (This may very well be an acceptable way of saying that something inside the mess hall is making noise, like it is in English, but I'm not sure.)
> 
> Compare:
> {chuSqu'choH jonta' pa'; Qom tlhoy'mey}
> {jonta' pa'Daq chuSqu'choHlu'; yay lulop jonwI'pu'}
> 
> Maybe I'm taking things too literally.
> 
> Qov:
> > qevDaq chen gho chIm 'ej 'oHDaq QamtaH ghutar, wot'avHey[78]. 
> > [78] Any comments on this as “the guy who seemed to be wot'av”?
> 
> DIp 'oHbe' {qev}'e'.  {ghom'a'} DaHechlaw'.
> 
> wot'avHey vIyaj 'ej vIlaj.
> 
> Qov:
> > jatlh Hota'ro', “nach DopDaq rIQ. So' jIbDaj.”
> 
> Qov:
> > “lu' qaH,” jatlh 'avwI' 'ej vay' rI'. loSmeH 'avwI' retlhDaq chobDaq [161] Qam vajar. tugh paw wochbogh 'avwI' tIn. SopwI'pa'vaD jatlh vajar, “Ha'! Hota'ro', HItlhej!” 
> > [161] Who requires a je here? I feel happy without it.
> 
> Do we have any canon of two {-Daq}ed nouns side by side like this?  The entire sentence is somewhat ambiguous and confusing to to me.  Is the {chob} next to the {'avwI'}, or is {vajar} (who is standing in a {chob}) next to the {'avwI'}?  Is the {'avwI'} also inside the {chob}?  What's the subject of {loSmeH}?  I think it's {vajar}, but initially I thought it was {'avwI'} until I got to the end of the sentence.  If it is {vajar}, I'd write {loSmeH vajar, 'avwI'...}.
> 
> --
> De'vID
> 
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