[Tlhingan-hol] nuq bop bom: 'ay' wa'vatlh wa'maH cha': <SuchwI' chaw'>

[Qov]

No, I'm really not, but I'm ashamed that there must be sufficient 
careless ghoS/jaH errors in my writing that you think I don't get the 
idea of ghoS. Like you, I was using Klingon before we had 
clarification on when to use -Daq with certain verbs, and some 
constructions have carried over.

The object of ghoS is a location.  nuqDaq is a word that you put in a 
sentence in place of a location in order to ask for the identity of 
the missing location.  If I can build a correct declarative sentence 
using ghoS, I can build one using nuqDaq.

nuq is a word you put in a sentence in place of an object or a 
concept, to ask for the identity of it. An object can be a 
destination, so I don't reject nuq DaghoS, but a location can too, so 
I accept nuqDaq DaghoS too.

- Qov

Sorry you got this twice, lojmIt tIwI' nuv - forgot to hit reply-all 
the first time.

At 08:44 05/01/2012, you wrote:
>To put it another way:
>
>nuqDaq DaghoS?
>
>is much more closely related to:
>
>nuqDaq bIHtaH?
>
>than it is to:
>
>nuq DaghoS?
>
>which is more closely related to:
>
>nuq DaqIp?
>
>Is it clear yet?
>
>Your destination is the thing that you {ghoS}. It's not the place 
>where you {ghoS}.
>
>You are clinging to the way this question is asked in English 
>instead of thinking about what the question really means.
>
>pItlh
>lojmIt tI'wI'nuv
>
>
>
>On Jan 5, 2012, at 10:07 AM, Qov wrote:
>
>>I understand the arguments against nuqDaq DaghoS, but to me the 
>>answer to nuq DaghoS is {tlhoy'vetlh} or {chob'a'vam}, not jonwI' choQ.
>>
>>Has nuq ever been used in canon as a destination?  Has 
>>interrogative where ever been translated without nuqDaq?
>>
>>I'll evade here with {nuq 'oH ghochlIj'e', HoD?}
>>
>>How would you feel about {nuqDaq DajaH?}?
>>
>>I really like these discussions and don't ever feel that I'm being 
>>nitpicked whether it's a mere qaghwI' or a using a verb against canon.
>>
>>- Qov
>>
>>At 06:49 05/01/2012, lojmIt tI'wI'nuv wrote:
>>>I disagree about {nuqDaq DaghoS} vs. {nuq DaghoS}. I think either 
>>>is acceptable and can be understood, but {nuq DaghoS} is 
>>>preferable if you want to know the target of one's travel, while 
>>>{nuqDaq DaghoS} is preferable if you want to identify a larger 
>>>location that contains the entire path one travels to get there.
>>>
>>>Remember that Okrand has explained to us that {ghoS} doesn't just 
>>>mean to go somewhere. It means to move along a path from something 
>>>to something. The direct object is an object located somewhere 
>>>along the path, most typically, the goal location. It's the thing 
>>>that, for the purposes of the sentence, the path is named after.
>>>
>>>If you add {-Daq}, then the noun isn't a direct object of {ghoS}, 
>>>it's the location that includes the path one travels upon while one {ghoS}s.
>>>
>>>In My Humble Opinion.
>>>
>>>I think he actually gave an example that {bIQtIq vIghoS} means "I 
>>>am going to the river," or "I'm traversing a path that includes 
>>>the river, probably as its destination," while {bIQtIqDaq vIghoS} 
>>>means "I'm in the river and I'm going somewhere." Also note that 
>>>{bIQtIqDaq jIghoS} is a perfectly formed sentence, while {bIQtIQ 
>>>jIghoS} is not. This implies that {bIQtIqDaq vIghoS} has an 
>>>unstated direct object, while {bIQtIQDaq} is the location of the 
>>>action of the verb, not its direct object.
>>>
>>>That's the key. If I ask {nuqDaq DaghoS?}, then I'm not asking 
>>>where you are headed. I'm asking everywhere you've been and intend 
>>>to go. I want the broader, all-inclusive location you are 
>>>traveling in; the entire zone, not just the direction.
>>>
>>>pItlh
>>>lojmIt tI'wI'nuv
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On Jan 4, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Qov wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hey, I missed you. You're part of the creative process now. :-)
>>>>
>>>>At 13:50 04/01/2012, you wrote:
>>>>>On Mon, Dec 26, 2011 at 1:53 PM, Qov 
>>>>><<mailto:robyn at flyingstart.ca>robyn at flyingstart.ca> wrote:
>>>>> > ngo' Duj 'ach veQ 'oHbe'bej.
>>>>>
>>>>>Do' veQDuj 'oHbe' veS'e'.
>>>>
>>>>lInDab Duj 'oH. 'ach Qu'DajvaD thoy ngo'.
>>>>
>>>>> > "nuqDaq DaghoS, HoD?"
>>>>>
>>>>>'utbe' <-Daq> qar'a'? I'm getting a "from whence" vibe here.
>>>>
>>>>jIQoch. I'm pretty sure nuqDaq is a chunk like QongDaq, not the 
>>>>same word as, say nuqDaq DaQeq = what are you aiming at.  If 
>>>>there were numerous objects in the room and you had to pick one 
>>>>to approach then sure, nuq DaghoS, but "Where are you going?" = nuqDaq DaghoS.
>>>>
>>>>...
>>>>- Qov
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Tlhingan-hol mailing list
>>>><mailto:Tlhingan-hol at stodi.digitalkingdom.org>Tlhingan-hol at stodi.digitalkingdom.org
>>>>http://stodi.digitalkingdom.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
>>_______________________________________________
>>Tlhingan-hol mailing list
>><mailto:Tlhingan-hol at stodi.digitalkingdom.org>Tlhingan-hol at stodi.digitalkingdom.org
>>http://stodi.digitalkingdom.org/mailman/listinfo/tlhingan-hol
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://stodi.digitalkingdom.org/pipermail/tlhingan-hol/attachments/20120105/895d801a/attachment-0001.html>