[Tlhingan-hol] Type 5 on first noun

[SuStel]

On 2/13/2016 7:25 AM, De'vID wrote:
> Also, {'uQ'a' QamchIyDaq} is very clearly wrong, for the meaning he
> wanted to express. It means "at the feast's Qam-Chee".

You insist that {QamchIyDaq 'uQ'a'} doesn't literally mean "at-Qamchee's 
feast," yet you say {'uQ'a' QamchIyDaq} must mean "at the feast's 
Qamchee"? Why isn't MY ordering just two unrelated nouns strung 
together? Just because a noun-noun is formed by putting two nouns next 
to each other, it doesn't follow that two nouns next to each other form 
a noun-noun. I seem to remember someone lecturing me on that. What if I 
want to insist that {'uQ'a' QamchIyDaq} means "the feast; at Qam-chee" 
as two unrelated nouns in a label, which doesn't have to follow any 
grammatical relationship?

That's a rhetorical question, meant to point out the bias inherent in 
your statement. You are invoking special hypothetical rules when you're 
fishing for an explanation, but not when such a rule wouldn't support 
your argument.

> So I agree that Okrand deliberately put {QamchIyDaq} in front of
> {'uQ'a'}. I also agree that it's possible that he was trying to form a
> noun-noun construction and forgot the rule about type 5 suffixes on
> the first noun. But it's not the only hypothesis that can explain the
> result.

No, it's not, but I didn't start by saying it WAS the only hypothesis. I 
started by giving MY hypothesis, as well as my assessment of how the 
translation came about, and others objected to it based on the circular 
logic of "it can't be an illegal noun-noun because that that -Daq makes 
a noun-noun illegal." My ire has been raised partly by having my 
arguments misrepresented as something completely different, partly by 
being compared to Fox News, but mostly because I'm being argued against 
with circular logic.

I've said all along that if Okrand would care to (a) admit it was an 
error, (b) retro-fit an explanantion, or (c) explain why it wasn't an 
error at all, I'd be perfectly fine with that. I'm also perfectly happy 
to leave the question unresolved. What I'm NOT fine with is people 
telling me to move along, there's nothing to see here, the issue is 
resolved.

-- 
SuStel
http://trimboli.name