[Tlhingan-hol] Klingon Word of the Day: rIQ

[Felix Malmenbeck]

A good example of the suffix -taH in action:

KGT (p. 112):
{vIHtaH gho.} ("The hoop is moving.")
"This expression means that an activity of finite
(though perhaps indeterminate) length has started."
[...]
"In the idiom,
the verb occurs with the suffix {-taH} ("continuous"), im-
plying that the hoop continues to roll for a period of time
(though it will not do so forever)."

Also, on page 90:
"The outer covering of a fruit or vegetable ({yub,}
"husk, rind, peel") is always consumed, except in the case
of the {naHlet yub} ("nut shell"). Klingons typically gnaw
({choptaH}---literally, "continue biting") on the nut until it
cracks open, and then they spit out ({tlhIS}) the pieces of
shell (occasionally at a nearby diner, as a gesture of so-
ciability) before chewing and swallowing the rest."

-taH here appears to be used to show that the biting isn't a single event, but a process.
{banan naH chevmeH chop ghaH.} - He bit the banana in order to sever it.
{naHlet yub ghor[-/taH/lI'?]meH choptaH ghaH.} - In order to break the nut shells, she gnawed on it.

Also, from HolQeD:
http://klingonska.org/canon/search/?file=1994-09-holqed-03-3-a.txt&get=source
-----------
HQ: Well, if {nobtaHghach} means something like <ongoing giving>, would
    {nobghach} mean a one-time donation?

MO: Yes, but it's a funny word for that. It could also be {nobpu'ghach}, a
    <*given>.

-----------



________________________________________
From: Felix Malmenbeck [felixm at kth.se]
Sent: Friday, February 03, 2012 00:29
To: David Trimboli; tlhingan-hol at stodi.digitalkingdom.org
Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Klingon Word of the Day: rIQ

I tend to subscribe more to SuStel's description of -taH vs. -lI'. -taH simply means that the process is a continuous one (and not completed at the point in time being referred to). A classic example is the vay yIjun means "Execute an evasive maneuver!" while yIjuntaH means "Take evasive action!"
Furthermore, to paraphrase TKD p.43, "The suffix -taH can be used whether there is a known goal or not."

With regards to bI'reng's examples:

>1. veng [lu]ghoStaH ghotpu'.
>2. veng [lu]ghoSlI' ghotpu'.
>I interpret #1 as meaning that people are always coming to the city.
> Maybe it's New York or veng wa'DIch--a big city that always has people
> going in and out.
> In interpet #2 as meaning that some people are on their way to the city.
> They left some time ago, and they're haven't arrived yet, but they will
> eventually.

I disagree. As SuStel mentions, the -taH simply means it's a continuous trip, with focus on the trip rather than its goal. The -lI' then adds the implication of a goal. However, to get the implication of "always" or "habitually", you'd need some other element, for example a mu' chuv like {reH} or {motlh}.

> 3. Duj tI'taH jonpIn.
> 4. Duj tI'lI' jonpIn.
> In #3, the engineer is always fixing the ship. There's always something
> broken on the ship, so the engineer is always fixing something. That's
> his job--it doesn't end. In #4, there is some damage he is fixing and
> eventually he will finish. Maybe he's repairing the warp core and the ship
> can't move until he's done.

The feeling I get from those two is that #3 means the engineer is working on fixing the ship (perhaps a specific problem, perhaps not, perhaps not even knowing yet what problems there are), whereas #4 explicitly implies that he/she is working towards some known set of conditions after which he/she will be done.

jIroptaH certainly doesn't strike me as meaning "I'm chronically ill"; it just means "I'm going through an illness".

I often get the feeling that there was a fairly grand vision for the Type-7 suffixes - something that would interact with the other suffixes to create distinctions and nuances both alien and useful - but that they ended up being elided so often that the real meaning started getting blurry, and now it's probably the most underused suffix class.

________________________________________
From: David Trimboli [david at trimboli.name]
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2012 23:40
To: tlhingan-hol at stodi.digitalkingdom.org
Subject: Re: [Tlhingan-hol] Klingon Word of the Day: rIQ

On 2/2/2012 5:38 PM, David Trimboli wrote:
>
> On 2/2/2012 4:50 PM, Brent Kesler wrote:
>>
>> 1. veng ghoStaH ghotpu'.
>> 2. veng ghoSlI' ghotpu'.
>>
>> 3. Duj tI'taH jonpIn.
>> 4. Duj tI'lI' jonpIn.
>>
>> I interpret #1 as meaning that people are always coming to the city.
>> Maybe it's New York or veng wa'DIch--a big city that always has people
>> going in and out.
>
> veng lughoStaH ghot[pu']
> veng lughoSlI' ghot[pu']
>
> (Unless you're talking about {vengpu'}...)

Err... that is... {vengmey}...

--
SuStel
http://www.trimboli.name/

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